Extreme Terrain
4x4Wire Trail Talk Forums: Jeep, Toyota, Mitsubishi, Pajero, Isuzu, Kia, 4WD, 4x4, SUV, Off-Road and OutdoorWire Forums

Search 4x4Wire



Recent Posts on TrailTalk
Engine Cylinder Repair/Re-sleeve?
by Stevie
Yesterday at 03:07 PM
Weber 32/36 DGV vs DFV
by Mudraider
01/20/17 02:27 AM
Kia Sportage SOHC 2.0 to DOHC 2.0 Motor Swap
by Coy77
01/19/17 11:07 PM
Stubborn Pully/Balancer Bolt; no f-bomb yet...
by dfreem01
01/19/17 02:57 AM
Hayabusa 2008 rods $368.00USD in US
by Racerfanny
01/19/17 02:04 AM
HELLWIG INTRODUCES AIR SPRINGS FOR THE 2016 NISSAN
by 4x4Wire
01/18/17 06:32 PM
Introducing the RV 770 LMT-S Navigator
by 4x4Wire
01/17/17 08:46 PM
Support 4x4Wire
New Topics on TrailTalk
Engine Cylinder Repair/Re-sleeve?
by Stevie
Yesterday at 03:07 PM
Kia Sportage SOHC 2.0 to DOHC 2.0 Motor Swap
by Coy77
01/19/17 11:07 PM
Hayabusa 2008 rods $368.00USD in US
by Racerfanny
01/19/17 02:04 AM
HELLWIG INTRODUCES AIR SPRINGS FOR THE 2016 NISSAN
by 4x4Wire
01/18/17 06:32 PM
Introducing the RV 770 LMT-S Navigator
by 4x4Wire
01/17/17 08:46 PM
1992 Pajero autolockers
by justforfun
01/16/17 12:13 AM
4x4 Gallery
Clearance check!
Testing the new Kenda Klever 31x10.50x15
My '88
4x4Wire YJ
IFS Holdout
More News on the 'Wire
4x4Voice
4x4Wire
MUIRNet-News
OutdoorWire
Who's Online
0 registered (), 144 Guests and 8 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
14,606 Registered Members
38 Forums
136,984 Topics
1,078,005 Posts

Most users ever online: 367 @ 12/16/16 07:24 PM
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#771750 - 12/13/06 05:55 AM Mating a NP231 to a Gen2 V4AW3
NathanC Offline
Roll Me Over
Registered: 04/22/02
Posts: 3620
Loc: Brodhead, WI
Started working on this project tonight. Dropped the bulky t-case out of my '94 SR in the hopes that I could get a NP231 transfer case to bolt up in its place.

The NP231 can be found in many Jeeps (especially Wranglers), and was also found behind the AW4 in some applications. The NP231 features a low range of 2.72:1 versus the stock Mitsu gearing of 1.90:1.

This is where things get interesting...
The Mitsu V4AW3 is built by Aisin Warner and variations of this transmission can be found in many different makes and models of vehicles. The one I paid attention to is the Jeep version which is the AW4.

I counted the splines on the tail shaft of my tranny and it appears to be a 23 spline unit just like the AW4. I bolted the tail housing from an AW4 up to my V4AW3.

Tomorrow night I will try to see if the NP231 will jive with everything else... <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/scared.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
'06 Dakota QC 4.7 6sp 4x4
[color:"red"]'88 Mighty Max project for sale[/color]
'77 KZ1000 fun old bike
'00 WJ prepped for a 4BD2T - someday I'll finish it.
Top
Support our sponsors
#771751 - 12/13/06 06:12 AM Re: Mating a NP231 to a Gen2 V4AW3 [Re: NathanC]
LandRaider Offline

Forum Moderator
Registered: 09/04/01
Posts: 8557
Loc: Ocean Springs, MS *****
Just that seal sizing is gonna be the only thing to play with, and once you research that out, and get a PN, it shoudl be gravy from then on for anyone to do this.

I hope it all works out eaisly.
_________________________
87 Raider 4D56td v5MT1
31's..Basically Stock
Top
#771752 - 12/13/06 01:23 PM Re: Mating a NP231 to a Gen2 V4AW3 [Re: LandRaider]
NathanC Offline
Roll Me Over
Registered: 04/22/02
Posts: 3620
Loc: Brodhead, WI
This is my Gen2 transmission. The other post I made was about the Gen1 KM148 transmission. Two different animals.

The seal will work on this setup because the seal is part of the AW4 tail housing. That tailhousing is an exact match for the NP231 transfer case. What is in question in this post is the length of the transfer case input shaft and the length of the transmission tail shaft.

My other post about the KM148 was to try to encourage some Gen1 owners to actually DO IT. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/kewl.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
'06 Dakota QC 4.7 6sp 4x4
[color:"red"]'88 Mighty Max project for sale[/color]
'77 KZ1000 fun old bike
'00 WJ prepped for a 4BD2T - someday I'll finish it.
Top
#771753 - 12/13/06 01:28 PM Re: Mating a NP231 to a Gen2 V4AW3 [Re: NathanC]
NathanC Offline
Roll Me Over
Registered: 04/22/02
Posts: 3620
Loc: Brodhead, WI
I would like to throw this out now and plan ahead...

I need some info from the service manuals about the electric speedo system. I have the '94 chassis, electrical, and engine manuals but none of them give me any information about the speedometer. I would like to get the electrical schematic for sure and any other info is just gravy.

Actually, now that I think about it, this information might be in the transmission-specific manual for that year(s).

Anybody have that? <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cyclops.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
'06 Dakota QC 4.7 6sp 4x4
[color:"red"]'88 Mighty Max project for sale[/color]
'77 KZ1000 fun old bike
'00 WJ prepped for a 4BD2T - someday I'll finish it.
Top
#771754 - 12/13/06 06:22 PM Re: Mating a NP231 to a Gen2 V4AW3 [Re: NathanC]
Lee N Offline
Rock Warrior
Registered: 02/16/01
Posts: 913
Loc: Ogden, UT
Does the '94 SR have an electronic speedo? All I see on the wiring diagram is the VSS built in to the instrument cluster. If it is cable driven, the NP231 should have a drive, or at least on the older ones ('87-'90). I believe the '90 to about '96 had a VSS on the T-case and I think the '97+ had something built in. Probably need to research to make sure.
_________________________
Lee
'94 LS, 3.0 V6, Auto, completely stock
Top
#771755 - 12/13/06 06:43 PM Re: Mating a NP231 to a Gen2 V4AW3 [Re: Lee N]
NathanC Offline
Roll Me Over
Registered: 04/22/02
Posts: 3620
Loc: Brodhead, WI
It's all electric. I think I might be able to use the stock Jeep electric sender because I'm assuming that they both work in the same manner (both utilize three wires). I'm sure it's just a pulse detection thing. If so, then I might just use something like this to modify the pulse count and even have an accurate speedo. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

It's too early for me to clearly say if that would work, but it can't be that complicated.

There is also some other pulse sensor that is mounted on the transmission tail housing that references to some goofy sheet steel star that is mounted to the tail shaft. It looks like the AW4 also used this because the AW4 tail housing has a mounting hole similar to the Mitsu one. I need to get one of those sensors from a Jeep and see if I can simply splice that into my harness. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/kewl.gif" alt="" />

And if I get all that straightened out, I still have to decide what exactly I want to do with the gobs of connectors that were hooked up to the t-case. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/shiner.gif" alt="" />
I'm not sweeting it though, if I go about it right, I might figure out something that works to my advantage. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/cheers.gif" alt="" />
_________________________
'06 Dakota QC 4.7 6sp 4x4
[color:"red"]'88 Mighty Max project for sale[/color]
'77 KZ1000 fun old bike
'00 WJ prepped for a 4BD2T - someday I'll finish it.
Top
#771756 - 12/13/06 07:36 PM Re: Mating a NP231 to a Gen2 V4AW3 [Re: NathanC]
Lee N Offline
Rock Warrior
Registered: 02/16/01
Posts: 913
Loc: Ogden, UT
I'm pretty sure the speedo sensor would have to come off of the end of the T-case, otherwise your speedo would be off in 4 low by a factor of 2.71. I'm positive that's the way it is on the NP231. I do recall the TJ's having some sort of built in sensor on the T-case output shaft instead of a VSS driven by a gear similar to what's on the cable drive.

For your T-case shifter, look at Novak. They have a pretty nice one that mounts to the case.
_________________________
Lee
'94 LS, 3.0 V6, Auto, completely stock
Top
#771757 - 12/13/06 07:42 PM Re: Mating a NP231 to a Gen2 V4AW3 [Re: Lee N]
LandRaider Offline

Forum Moderator
Registered: 09/04/01
Posts: 8557
Loc: Ocean Springs, MS *****
vss has to do with Pulse count, and it's usually determined with pulse per mile.

I bet the GM sensor will give an output, but I dont know if it will be accurate. Try and see!!!

If not, it's gonna be kinda tough to modify psyically. There is an actual reluctor ring on the output shaft that counts the rev's, so youd have to machine a new one with the appropriate number of "teeth" on it.

To change it electronically, I think you're gonna need a DRAC, or something like that.
_________________________
87 Raider 4D56td v5MT1
31's..Basically Stock
Top
#771758 - 12/13/06 07:45 PM Re: Mating a NP231 to a Gen2 V4AW3 [Re: Lee N]
NathanC Offline
Roll Me Over
Registered: 04/22/02
Posts: 3620
Loc: Brodhead, WI
Yeah, I'm sorry if what I said was confusing, but I was referring to two separate sensors serving two separate purposes. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Quote:
For your T-case shifter, look at Novak. They have a pretty nice one that mounts to the case.

You're right, they are nice. My application will get a little more complicated than just one shifter. <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Right now I'm trying to determine if the t-case will mate to the transmission. Once that is done, the stock t-case and everything else goes back on so I can drive it around. The NP231 will go in for good when I decide to start the SAS <img src="/forums/images/graemlins/evil.gif" alt="" />. In the mean time I would like to try to figure out the electrical details.

Do you have any info from the FSM's on the electric speedo, Lee?
_________________________
'06 Dakota QC 4.7 6sp 4x4
[color:"red"]'88 Mighty Max project for sale[/color]
'77 KZ1000 fun old bike
'00 WJ prepped for a 4BD2T - someday I'll finish it.
Top
#771759 - 12/13/06 08:04 PM Re: Mating a NP231 to a Gen2 V4AW3 [Re: Lee N]
LandRaider Offline

Forum Moderator
Registered: 09/04/01
Posts: 8557
Loc: Ocean Springs, MS *****
Quote:
For your T-case shifter, look at Novak. They have a pretty nice one that mounts to the case.


Look at a 97 S10 shifter out of the junkyard or off of Ebay. It's nice, and ALOT cheaper!!! Cable operated so no floor hacking.
_________________________
87 Raider 4D56td v5MT1
31's..Basically Stock
Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >

Moderator:  Macka, Mudraider, off-roader, PajEvo, rxinhed 

OutdoorWire Websites

OutdoorWire

OutdoorWire

Portal page for OutdoorWire Access and Landuse Central Read More
4x4Voice

4x4Voice

California off road recreation news and information Read More
MUIRNet News

MUIRNet News

News and information about issues affecting outdoor recreation Read More
4x4Wire

4x4Wire

Off road recreation and 4x4 Technical news and information Read More
TrailTalk

TrailTalk

4x4Wire TrailTalk Forums for a variety of 4x4 tech information Read More
  • 1

4x4Wire Tech Section

Jeep 4x4 Tech

Jeep 4x4 Tech

Jeep Tech from JeepWire Read More
Toyota 4x4 Tech

Toyota 4x4 Tech

Toyota Tech from 4x4Wire Read More
Mitsubishi 4x4 Tech

Mitsubishi 4x4 Tech

Mitsubishi Tech from 4x4Wire Read More
Isuzu 4x4 Tech

Isuzu 4x4 Tech

Isuzu Tech from 4x4Wire Read More
  • 1

Search the 4x4Wire site:




4x4Wire Social: | 4x4Wire on FaceBook | Google+4x4Wire on Google+

OutdoorWire, 4x4Wire, JeepWire, TrailTalk, MUIRNet-News, and 4x4Voice are all trademarks and publications of OutdoorWire, Inc. and MUIRNet Consulting
Copyright (c) 2000-2016 OutdoorWire, Inc and MUIRNet Consulting - All Rights Reserved, no part of this publication may be reproduced in any form without express written permission
You may link freely to this site, but no further use is allowed without the express written permission of the owner of this material.
All corporate trademarks are the property of their respective owners.